Holy Coves singer-songwriter Scott Marsden sits down with Mick from Dictator to talk tours, talent and the indpendent music scene

Scott – Hi it’s nice to meet you, so do you like to be called Michael or Mike?

Mick – So actually, I’m affectionately known by alot of our fans as Mick.

Scott – I like that, nice to meet you Mick!

Mick – Nice to meet you too.

Scott – So if you could give us an introduction to yourself. Who you are and where your from?

Mick – Well, as you can tell by the accent, we’re up in the North of the border, we’re right in between Edinburgh and Glasgow, so if you know anything about accents, regional dialects, we have the worst of both accents! We have a mix of Glaswegian and Edinburgh and whenever we go Edinburgh they think were Glaswegians, whenever we go to Glasgow they think we’ve got an Edinburgh accent. So we’re right in between in a place called West Lothian. Snuts, Lewis Capaldi, there is a lot from West Lothian. The old adage is that there is something in the water, I genuinely believe there is, so yes that’s where we’re about. If you listen to our music eclectic is quite a good word to describe it. We first formed, thinking about Gorillaz, as in they weren’t really tied to one thing, eventually we started evolving, we are starting to find our sound, it’s like a quirky, poppy, indie type vibe. It’s really fun to play live. So if we had a tag line it would be “It’s really fun to play live” that’s what were going for.

Scott – I definitely get the fun vibe, I’ll let you in on a little secret, I have three boys, 14, 11 and 10, a wife and a dog and you guys are our family band, you’re one of my favourite bands, my whole family know and love your songs, I swear even our dog knows your songs! You definitely bring the fun vibe to music. I definitely see the evolution in what you’ve done, it’s massive. That could piss old fans off couldn’t it?

Mick – That’s kind of where we’re at, I’m glad you noticed that. We come from an indie background, ‘Sad Boy Bangers’ we used to call them, we’ve got a song called ‘Hide and Seek’ which is the penultimate ‘Sad Boy Banger’. Love playing it live when I can sing it, when I go on tour it can be harder to sing it, I will be honest, especially if we’ve had a few pints the night before. We were an indie band and that was a vibe but you almost play like a characateur of it, let’s play some ‘Sad Boy Bangers’. We are not those people! You start being authentic to you, Some of us have a dog, a wife and kids and so we are essentially those people and so trying to pretend that we’re these kind of cool, indie rockers, nah! It’s going to fall flat on it’s face. We might write some decent indie rock tunes, but we’re not going to be involved in that, we’re not going to be all in. When you are just completely yourself and playing stuff you enjoy, it’s good both ways because you can play the stuff you enjoy and people enjoy it.

Scott – I can see the joy on your face as your talking about it, so you are all loving exactly where you are at and what you’re doing.

Mick – Yeah we are. The thing for me, right is, the way to look at it in terms of each time we go on tour, we’ve only just started doing tours but we’ve been a couple of years as a band. You get this false sense of being well ahead of yourself, you play to a hundred cap and sell out and then you think we may as well book out an arena. You get like ‘Guys, we’re on the trajectory, we’re going to reach the top, let’s leave our jobs!’ and then you go play another couple and it’s like actually no one knows who we are! No one knows outside of our close circle of friends and family. There’s been a couple of times in the last year or two when we’ve played gigs outside, success to us at the start, was playing outside the central belt of Scotland, that was successful and then after a couple of months we played Newcastle. What’s mental though is that when we started off we went to a pub in London last year, our sound engineer nearly…so he reversed into the venue and he thought he had killed the drummer. A part of the van is etched onto the pub. I can’t think of the name of the venue. We sold 60 tickets there, phenomenal. A year later we went there we sold out and I think it was 150 cap, that was mind blowing. The more we get into this rabbit hole of success and enjoying it and seeing people react to the songs, selling a 150 cap venue out in a place you’ve never really been and you don’t know many people there, that is the most fulfilling thing ever. It makes it totally worth being in a crowded wee van!

Scott – Ha Yes! We know how that goes. I love playing to people, I love the interaction, I love connecting to people I like being able to look people in the eye. Someone said it’s like a new shoegaze has been invented except you don’t look at your shoes, you look them in the eyes and make eye contact. That’s what it’s about isnt’t it? You’ve got to connect to the audience. I don’t want to be there rocking out and being fake, I want a real connection to people. I’m trying to portray my song because it means something. As much as your having a laugh with your pals in them songs, you mean those songs, mean those lyrics, they’re heartfelt. They have a story.

Mick – Definitely. That’s the kind of vibe your trying to get to. We’ve got a song coming out soon, I’m not going to mention that because I don’t know the exacts, it’s all cloak and dagger, it’s good to go, we just need to get it approved, but we wrote that as though we were playing live. You start making songs you know you’re going to enjoy when you play them live. That’s mental and to even consider that when you’re writing a song, that you’re going to enjoy playing that, because you’re making tunes and it’s heartfelt and it’s great. But it’s actually a good laugh to play. Alan has this SBD pad, for drummers, I don’t know if you’ve seen these, basically it’s a computer behind Dictator and there’s a little bell on Rubik’s Cube our song and he goes to town with that, quirky little things that we have built into our songs. We chuck rubiks cubes out to the crowd sometimes and he tinkles the little bell, see stuff like that, that’s what we love.

Scott – Brilliant! it’s good and you can see that you’re thinking outside the box, you’re thinking bigger. It is a completely different dynamic writing a song from home and it’s just a song you’ve written for home and then writing a song with the interaction in mind. Going back to Gorillaz like you mentioned earlier, they definitely thought outside the box.

Mick – How they did the visual element was phenomenal but there’s also a performance they’ve done, I can’t remember the song name just because I am being interviewed and it’s going to escape me even though it’s one of my favourite songs. But the one with the school choir and they’re at the Brit Awards and they play with a school choir. It was phenomenal, and they weren’t even there, they were, but they were behind the curtain. They managed to create this amazing thing. Everybody was enjoying being involved in, everyone was enjoying watching. And the music is one part, the boring part is having to be clued up about tours, then you’ve got the actual reason for why your doing it which is playing shows and for us it’s like you need to have a bit of theatre.

Scott – Ofcourse! I plan to watch you live this year, I’m figuring out which show I can make it to, we’re on Anglesey. West Lothian is becoming quite famous isn’t it? We’re from a little place on Anglesey and they’re trying to say that there is something in the water here aswell! For such a tiny island there is massive talent here. Ren, have you seen him popping up online?

Mick – No, I haven’t but I will look him up, anyone else to listen out for?

Scott – Ren, he is one that has gone viral. He’s from Anglesey, Megan Wyn is from down the road too. She has got a phenomenal voice and for her age she is a phenomenal songwriter, and ofcourse you’ve got Holy Coves.

Mick – Exactly, number one.

Scott – Ha! I wouldn’t say we’re number one but we have got another act which I really hope he comes out with a record, Caine Jones-Williams. No one has really heard him in our world, online and getting out there but when they hear this guy they’re going to be blown away. So West Lothian, you started out from West Lothian?

Mick – So we all went to a school called St. Margarets, Allan and Zach, Zach is the guitarist and Allan is the drummer, they’re a few years older than us, they’re our big brothers right, however we all grew up together in West Lothian, we were in different bands but all on the same scene. And you should see the size of this place, you would be wondering how there is even a scene. But we’ve all played together and we all played in different bands and that’s kind of how we grew up. The kind of thing where you play a gig in a pub when your fifteen to other bands. That’s who you’re playing to, to other bands. Honestly at the time you think it’s rubbish, but no, it’s the best! Make the most of it, enjoy it because it is quality. As soon as you play in front of people who have bought tickets you have to be good. So yeah that’s where we all grew up and because we had had a few jams together we realised we enjoyed it and we had a gig where we had five different instruments each, we were too outside the box, we were a bit weird at the start so we had to figure it out to bring it back into the box slightly. But then we were like let’s just be weird and see what happens. Let’s be weird together.

Scott – Well it’s definitely doing well, it’s getting bigger, it’s growing and I’m always pushing you to as many people as I possibly can. For me that is what independent music is about, you don’t get to where your going or where your heading without everyone who is supporting independent music. Have you got any plans for touring?

Mick – September, October. September 8th is Liverpool, September 22nd London, 29th Birmingham, 30th Newcastle and then end of October, 27th is Leeds 28th is Manchester. So that is our first chance to go touring, our first proper tour.

Scott – It’s a big tour.

Mick – We’ve been trying to figure out who follows us and from where and then we have announced this, these are our first cities that we can then start branching out from. The hope is, is that next year if we can do another tour if this one goes successfully and doesn’t pull us into financial oblivion then we will be able to go back and also pick more cities as we go. Hopefully it becomes one of those things you can start branching out from. The other thing aswell is being able to play decent venues. You’ll know, you want a decent venue and to be able to put on a good show and there is some that are basically a guys hut and there is nothing wrong with that, it’s amazing but also you can’t really do what you can in these bigger venues and put on the same level of show as you’d like. You can’t bring a brass section with you because it would just get drowned out. So we’re at that point, trying to build on these central places. If people like us then maybe we can branch out, build up to an arena tour in a couple of years.

Scott – Ofcourse, it’s possible and you’re on that path, I’ve got no doubts about that. You’re doing it carefully, planning it meticulously. You’ve done your graft and now the pennies dropped, you know what you’re doing. Is this tour done by you or with This Feeling?

Mick – It’s with This Feeling. We’ve been working with quite a few promoters but This Feeling have been good, they help alot of bands who are up and coming, they’ve got a lot of festivals and stages. When we first started working with them we weren’t sure if we were going to fit the mold of what is a This Feeling band because we had it in our head that a This Feeling band was something. I think we’re doing really well of changing that preception. Hopefully we are one of those bands that is coming along a changing that perception. Normally for This Feeling it’s been Rock n Roll. Not that we aren’t Rock n Roll.

Scott – You are! You’ve defnitely got a bit of that. I know what you mean.

Mick – But This Feeling have been helping to put on the tour and there’s alot we don’t know. I’d like to think we are self aware enough to know that we don’t know so we rely on these guys to help us start building decent coverage of all the areas. It’s a simple as we’re going to Manchester, they’ve got about eighty venues that they can say here are the different venues, the different capacities, the availabilities, you just can’t get that doing it yourself, you could in time but you’d have to start way back.

Scott – I know Mike from This Feeling, I work with them myself with Holy Coves aswell, I understand everything you just said. They get alot of flack off bands who maybe don’t get on some of the festivals, what I think they’re missing the point of is they’re promoters at the end of the day, I’m not saying they don’t give opportunities to bands, because they do, but sooner or later if you’re not selling tickets in an area then you can’t keep bringing these bands over to go play gigs. I’ve seen things online where they are copping a bit of stick, but it’s the nature of the game, they are promoters at the end of the day, they are more than that but the bigger picture for me is that they are helping out with exactly what you’ve said in the way you said. They know what they’re doing, they are experienced and I trust them fully and I think what they are doing is absolutely amazing.

Mick – Yeah definitely and it’s crucial to helping us build a profile in areas that we have never been to before and what we see is that you get certain support slots with certain people aswell and we went down to Manchester and London with This Feeling in February and the reception was amazing, there is people that have come along who have never heard of us but they have come along because it is This Feeling. It helps you to grow it. It’s cool to see your reach growing because then you’re writing songs for people to hear, so when people hear them the happier you become.

Scott – Exactly that, that’s what it’s all about. You dont’ just write these records for nothing, wether you write a happy, pop, fun record or a rock record that is heartfelt, the aim of the game for me has always been to play songs to people and connect to people and more so now more than ever. I feel like I’m at the age where I have for the first time sussed it out, I was away for a long while but when I came back to music this time I came back with a plan. I decided to set up my own record label and do as much things in house as possible, learn all the tools that are available. That’s one thing I have been explaining to younger bands, everything is there for you to learn. If you were to give advice to any young up and coming band would you have any advice for them?

Mick – I would say buy tickets to our tour! Nah, just that, you’ve hit the nail on the head there in terms of even when we are given the best opportunity possible, we supported The Fratellis in a venue up here and that was a learning opportunity, that is the best way to describe it is as a learning opportunity, you get to play in front of like 1500 people, when are you going to get the chance to do that again? It’ll be interesting to see what you need to do in order to do that. Every single thing that you get is a chance to do the next thing. That’s the best way to describe it. This tour is a chance to see if there is a tour next year and so on. We were like ultra planned, probably a bit intense, sometimes we were like seventeen steps ahead in our planning. My main thing is to anybody who’s starting off in music have a little bit of a think in terms of what your after because sometimes in music, even if your just wanting to enjoy playing it, double down on that, do the things you enjoy then, don’t play songs you don’t and also take everything as a learning opportunity to do the next thing and never stop, you’ll never make it, even if your on an arena tour and you’ve sold your double platinum, you’ve just got to enjoy it because that is the main thing, because you’re never going to resent that or regret that, that even in 40 years time when you look back and that’s us done after the last couple of years I know we would look back fondly and say that we genuinely gave that everything we could and that for us is our main goal as a band. We’ve been in bands before where we thought we were done, thought our life was over at 18 and then suddenly you just think lets just go an enjoy this, make the most of it and be present while we do it so that when we look back we can say we gave it a very good shot. So yeah enjoy it and don’t just think there is a level you reach and that is it. Enjoy the process.

Scott – Yeah for me it’s to keep believing in that dream, keep that drive, that passion. You’re right, unless you love it then there is no point doing it.

Mick – Sometimes you don’t enjoy it, anybody who enjoys being stuffed in a van for about three or four days with your pals, sweaty, it’s uncomfortable, you’re tired, loading in and loading out, that part is not enjoyable but it’s worth playing live music for. And that’s what you need to remember, it’s always worth it.

Scott – I always find on tour by the time I come back my body feels battered, I’m exhausted, my body and my mind, I feel like I’ve done a heavy session of training, my body aches, that’s the reality of it!!

Mick – The worse thing about being a singer is you can’t drink, if you want to be performing optimally. When you start charging money for shows and there’s a couple of hundred people coming, you actually can’t have a couple of pints that night because you feel like you need to be ready and that sucks! Because you just want to see everybody, speak to everybody and catch up but you actually can’t.

Scott – Well exactly, it’s work. You’re there to work. We’re the same, we pretty much keep away from all that on tour, we want to be professional and that’s also another piece of advice for other bands too. You can have a couple of beers and have some fun but if you want to be professional then you’ve got to knuckle down and give people the best show you possibly can. So you’ve just recentely sold out King Tuts, congratulations!

Mick – An amazing venue. Each time you do that stuff you just don’t believe it’s happened. Feel like you’re on the mega party bus. Ha! You just keep rolling on and then it’s in six months time when you look back and you think ‘that was class’. It doesn’t sink in properly, too many dopamine rushes!

Scott – What an experience, you will remember that for the rest of your life.

Mick – Yeah definitely. Two of us are into golf.

Scott – Gareth Bale too!

Mick – Exactly, legend. We wore the white boiler suits that the caddies wear and spray painted King Tuts in green writing and even just keeping that, that’s just class.

Scott – It looked like an amazingly, brilliant show, I wish I had been there. But I will make sure I get to watch you this year. So you’re last release was the Rubik’s Cube EP.

Mick – It’s an EP with a couple of interludes through it. It’s five tracks. We released that September last year. Since then we have been away cooking up some stuff. It’s difficult to know what to do and how to do it beyond that EP. Also the hardest thing in music is to give it time to run, to just let it happen, let it out into the ether and let people digest it.

Scott – Yeah I found that difficult.

Mick – So we’re currently at that moment in time, we have got a few things up our sleeves. The EP smashed every expectation we had for it. But no matter what you do in music, you only feel as relevant as your next thing.

Scott – It’s like a healthy competition within, I’m at that stage myself with the next record, Druid and Bards Part Two. We’ve written that and we’re going to record it soon. I’m really excited to see what comes from you guys next, in all aspects, live and visually but especially new music.

Mick – You have to make a release worthwhile. The release is one thing but you have to make sure you maximise the amount of people who are going to hear it, plan to do a video at the same time. Basically, don’t half arse it. That’s the best thing we have realised. Don’t just take it for granted because it will be recieved like that. We need to treat every release like it is our favourite song in the world. So yes, few things up our sleeve and hopefully in the next few months we can start teasing everything out because it feels like an age since our last record but it is for a reason.

Scott – It’s good to take your time. You should get yourself down to Wrexham, it’s all really happening down there at the moment.

Mick – So are you a Wrexham fan? Are you happy with the whole situation?

Scott – I am, I took my wife and kids to watch the game that weekend and we soaked up all the atmosphere. One of the best days of our lives, it was absolutley amazing. What’s your team?

Mick – I think it’s brilliant, they’ve done it in the right way, I’m a celtic fan. They’ve got the best intentions for Wrexham but also everybody wins. The team wins, the fans win, they win, the whole city wins. From the outside it is just the most perfect thing. Look at Salford, it’s all egos but they were like, didn’t have a clue and I think that’s better.

Scott – But in a way it makes them more clued up, and even the whole family vibe. There is something there to be learnt for everyone, even bands, looking at how to do something right. Absolutely brilliant comparison you just gave of Wrexhams and Salford.

Scott – It’s been a pleasure talking to you Mick. Thankyou so much for talking to me today, I really appreciate it.

Mick – No worries at all, thankyou for having me. Cheers.




Emily Marsden – Editor
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